We Talk CHUCK finale; LOST finale; SUPERNATURAL finale and more!
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It's not related directly to podcast, but to the finales yes. I noticed one thing in last 3 episodes, Sarah has no clear purpose as a character now, she is still passive in her life decissions, like in finale she just accepted Chuck decission without any oposition (while i agree it's "in character" for her, since she was always pushed around first by father, then by Graham, Shaw and now Chuck). So i hope next season they give her character clear direction and story, so she will become more active about the things that are happening around her.
ReplyDeleteHi!
ReplyDeleteYour podcast is awesome as usual.
I hope you'll make another video for chuck and sarah on youtube soon.
Marilou from Greece
Not relevant to the finale or the blogspot, but relevant to your Kristin Kreuk obsession. apparently they want her back at Smallville too, as per the Tom Welling so get ready to fight superman for her :p
ReplyDeleteOh, now that i listned to your podcast i agree that they also need to widen Sarah character interaction to Morgan and especially Ellie. Because right now her character is just extension of Chuck, so it would be nice if they give her something to do that is not directly connected to Chuck.
ReplyDeleteTHEY CANNOT HAVE KRISTIN KREUK!!!!
ReplyDeleteKisku,
ReplyDeleteSarah was OK with Chuck leaving the spy world. It was implied when Chuck asked whether she was OK with just a regular guy that she would be staying on as a spy. In other words Chuck decided that he wasn't going to be a spy. He in no way made a decision for Sarah.
How about we send Shaw to Smallville and we keep Kristin Kreuk? Fair deal IMO, Smallville is ending anyways, he can't do much damage :)
ReplyDeleteI'm calling it now .....
ReplyDeleteS4 will be the last as you suggested , Magnus . But we will get 22 episodes. NBC will order the back 9 with a " TBD " air date , which I expect them to burn off in the Summer of ' 11 . That's unless a few new shows tank and the ratings can be held in the mid to low 2's ( who are we kidding ? lol ) .
Spearhead
These final two episodes are amazing, and with the exception of Chuck vs. The Role Models, this entire 6-episode arc is outstanding. I just purchased Season 3 DVDs today and I hope to recruit new Chuck fans this summer.
ReplyDeleteI love how the show has set itself up for next season. I hope there are future elements of Chuck working against CIA interests. I like the idea of Chuck being a rogue agent and potentially going against Beckman.
I'm guessing Stephen Bartowski was protecting Mary Bartowski in some way. It'll be interesting to see how she fits into the mythology and if Chuck has to now protect his mother and whatever her work is.
I agree that Sarah's been somewhat minimized recently and I hope her backstory somehow becomes an integral part of next season. The show needs the audience to invested in her character. That said, it's been nice to have the show free of her and Chuck's angst and the will they/won't they. If Sarah's going to be a force next season I hope it's not because of relationship issues.
In regards to the podcast, I'm the guy who complained about too many participants and people talking over each other, so you can probably imagine my feelings for this latest installment, and even the one before it. The problem is the women. They need to chill out. Queen Wendy's mostly fine, but Cynical J and Baby Doll are momentum killers. Every cool topic you brought up got quashed by interruptions.
Just saying, they should be encouraging conversation not stymieing it.
I'm still a fan and thanks for everything you do for my favorite show.
Bad Leg
Shaw (Brandon Routh) is actually going to be starring in "The Walking Dead" series. If you ask me it's kind of appropriate. (I keed, I keed).
ReplyDeleteMuzzle down!
Kisku was right Sarah has become an accessory for Chuck. Is just like one of those Behind the scenes interviews where you see her lips moving but hear nothing. Sure she is great to look at but the best scene of the last two episodes was when she and Chuck were at the market, I wish they could have carried the dialogue longer the chemistry was incrediable.
ReplyDeleteThey were able to make her Chucks partner in the honeymooners, with her spy and kick ass abilities she is the intersect without tne intersect.
I agree that they should make Sarah more integrated to the storyline than just as Chuck's boyfriend/sidekick. Let her interact with more characters and have her own little storyline. Like what did happen to her mother?
ReplyDeleteWe have not had an episode about her since Delorean.
Regarding the Chuck/Sarah relationship I hope they stop having him lie to her. Ir have been a too much this last episodes. I guess he had his reasons, but I hope they're not making it a recurring problem.
HJ
Hey magnus have you seen this? kinda funny.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.collegehumor.com/video:1936291
Have to say the women getting pregnant on the island and ending up dying thing bugs me since it's the whole reason that Juliet was brought on the island.
The back 6 were far superior to the first 13...but they have got to work on the consistency show to show. One minute all Chuck wants in the world is to be a REAL SPY and the next he's dropped that for Ellie. What about Sarah and his vow to stay in the spy life with her? After all the angst this season over Chuck's decision to be a spy without talking it out with Sarah, it seemed inconsistent. His brief "can you be with a regular guy" didn't cover it. I will remain hopeful that they will learn from the missteps of this season and will bring it in season 4 which I too believe will be the last.
ReplyDelete@Rick
ReplyDeleteWhile I agree that the show can be a bit inconsistent at times, I don't think him quitting for Ellie necessarily is. Their father had just died, that bound to have an effect on him. But I agree that he should have discussed it with Sarah first, such a decision affect her too. He needs to be more honest with her and let her be a part of important decisions. His first instinct when something is up should be to go to her, not Morgan.
Looking forward to the next and sadly last season. I hope the showrunners knows/realizes this and make and satisfying end to the series. I'm glad that we were lucky enough to get another season. While I think the finale was great, I would not have been satisfied with such an ending.
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KL
You should really address your issues TO THE WRITERS not the characters. See, the characters only do what the writers make them do... they are, after all, FICTIONAL characters. :)
ReplyDeleteI agree, but when discussing the story it makes sense to attribute it to the characters not the writers ;)
ReplyDeleteAnyways, great podcast :)
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KL
As long as you realize they are not real. :)
ReplyDeleteIf I ever started to think they where real you are hereby allowed to end my life or place me in the loony bin. Whatever you choice ;)
ReplyDelete-
KL
Diane says...
ReplyDeleteHey, Magnus, heard you talk about ratings in the podcast. Don't know for sure if you referring to me and don't know exactly what info you are looking for, but I've been examining them pretty closely. I don't have many big revelations, but here's what I've got:
1. As can be figured out from TVBTN, of the four shows that aired on the 4 big nets, only the CBS comedies had an increase in ratings from what aired the previous week for A18-49. The increase for CBS did not match the cumulative decrease of the other three networks.
2. The number of A18-49 watching TV did not go down from the previous week, so the decrease can't be explained by fewer people watching TV.
3. Looking elsewhere (from the big nets), there was a basketball game on ESPN that got a pretty big rating for Men 18-49 (a 5.6 rating).
4. I looked at minute-by-minute ratings for Chuck (yes, there is a such thing if one has the right access), the ratings for the show itself DID NOT go down during the course of the 2 hours. In fact, the highest rated minutes were during the climactic Chuck/Shaw fight and the last few minutes. What was going on, however, was that there were huge dips in viewing during the commercials toward the end. It may have been people switching away to see what was happening on "24" or the basketball game and then switching back. When you see that the average rating for the 2nd hour wasn't great, it was for that reason. Example: Minute 107 had a 2.13 A18-49 rating. Minute 110: 1.35 (clearly a commercial break)
5. The pure Live rating for Chuck was down from the prev. week by 4% vs. Live + SD down 6%. Men 18-49 was down 5% (L+SD) Women 18-49 down 7%. Men 25-54 and Men 35-64 weren't down at all from the previous week. So, the losses were at the younger end.
6. On the male/female split topic, I don't think the male percentage for the show was ever in the 60%+ range. Only sports does that. The finale was about 52% male/48% female. Keep in mind that most primetime shows are 40% male/60% female. So, Chuck has RELATIVELY more men watching than a typical show. Plus, there are more women in the population than men. So, anytime you break 50% for a male composition in primetime TV for a non-sports show, it's significant. Still, the show could do better for women.
(sorry for the long post)
Thank you, Diane.
ReplyDeleteI am pretty sure I read that during season 2 the male to female was around 60 to 40. That may have changed this season (can you check on that?). In any event, as you say, having more men than women watching any program is significant (as men 18-34 and 18-49 are considered the toughest to attract). CHUCK truly does need more female viewers, especially since that would indicate general increase in viewership.
As for the basketball game, that makes sense. I didn't consider that the overall ratings would be affected by people flipping to the game, or 24 finale, or even DWTS, to see what was going on, negating their ratings for the half hour (this is how it works, right?).
Anyway, thank you again for the information. This has given me a wider perspective on the situation. :)
"I am pretty sure I read that during season 2 the male to female was around 60 to 40. That may have changed this season (can you check on that?)."
ReplyDeleteI just checked a run I had for the January - April average. It was 52% male/48% female.
Diane
For season 2? Interesting. I will now need to dig around to see where I got that number (it hovers in my mind).
ReplyDeleteI know that the writers are responsible for guiding these characters and so we cannot blame the characters themselves, but I think they had to cram so much into the final 2 hours that it was impossible for them to find a good enough reason for chuck to quit and take over his dad work so they just threw in the ellie asking him to quit. I am with the people who say that Ellie should never have the right to make him make that decision without talking to sarah first, and it is not because I am a shipper or think these characters are real it is because in the last 6 episodes they the characters went from wanting to be spies together, to saying they want to be together in 30 years and have a life outside of the cia, to saying IO love you to showing their wills so this episode just threw that all out of the window, this was not true to their characters and I have heard rachael and Jess say the same thing about the shaw/sarah arc, she did things not true to her character and I think that is why the whole chuck thing quitting did not sit well with anyone.
ReplyDeleteIt is ridiculous to say the episode tossed it all out the window. That is what a crazy shipper would say. It may not have been constructed well (which is typical showrunner writing... they always seem to just do whatever they want, on every show when they write the scripts), but it didn't toss out everything that was established. See, Chuck and Ellie's dad HAD NOT DIED YET when they made those statements. That is a major event in their lives. Things like that can change everything and that was the point. Could it have been done better? I sure think so but it didn't violate story canon.
ReplyDeleteMaybe we should wait and see where the story goes next season before jumping to conclusions.
ReplyDeleteChuck quit because he didn't want to lie to Ellie. If Ellie finds out about their mother or realizes that Sarah is the most important person to her brother, she may giver her blessing for him to become a spy again.
Incoming... the inevitable "but he has been lying to her for three years!" But he was lying to protect her. Plus, he never made her a promise before like this. He promised her that he would quit the CIA. He did. I don't think he said he wouldn't search for their mother.
ReplyDeleteAlso we know how important family is to Ellie. If Chuck somehow has to rejoin or work with the CIA to find their mom Ellie may have a change of heart. I would think she would realize it would be safer having Sarah and Casey around instead of Chuck going all lone wolf on missions.
ReplyDeleteAnd this is my own little fanon. Ellie still sees Chuck as her nerdy little brother. Not the spy he's become. It almost how Orion saw Chuck until Living Dead and then he realized how great of a spy Chuck was.
I bet they will use the promise to create some emotional problems for them both next season. I just hope they write it convincingly so it isn't just a device to create drama. I don't mind drama devices as long as they make sense.
ReplyDeleteYeah I can see that happening. It could also lead to problems between Ellie and Sarah. And depending how its handled, that could be very interesting.
ReplyDeleteI'm just in the mindset that the show story wise is in much better place going forward after the finale this season than last year.
Same.... even before I realized I knew how the season was going to play out, I KNEW season 3 would be about keeping Chuck and Sarah apart and it pissed me off because I felt it would only hurt the overall story. I just didn't know how badly they would handle that element (the other elements I was mostly fine with). So, I feel that season 4 is set up for a much better story telling pace and won't have any Shaw-type romance elements that could grind the show to a halt.
ReplyDeleteHi Magnus,
ReplyDeleteI am looking forward to team working together again woth Morgan in it I mean he is just too funny not to have him involved. His line at the end "Am I on some hero streak or what, when your hot your hot!" lol and his cobra reference. I think there could also be hillarity in that if the season starts off with sarah and casey waking morgan in the middle of the night to go on a mission and chuck starts to feel left out and make him want to get back in the team would be great comedy. I heard your podcast about Zach mabe needing to take a few martial arts classes over the summer, I think that in some way over the summer I hope gomez takes some gun shooting lessons and learn some new skills would be great to to add more to his character, he already has guts, I mean come on breaking your thumbs, he just needs to be a little more skill orientated while still being funny would be great.
Another point about how funny josh was at the end when he was talking about finding the detenator you could see Zach, Yvonne and Adam trying not to laugh and hold serious faces, classic! Josh did not just make us laugh but even the cast and the fact that morgan let jeffster take the fall for blowing up the buymore was brilliant, lol
ReplyDeleteSame.... even before I realized I knew how the season was going to play out, I KNEW season 3 would be about keeping Chuck and Sarah apart and it pissed me off because I felt it would only hurt the overall story.
ReplyDeleteThat sounds like something a crazy shipper would say.
No, it sounds like something someone who likes a quality story would say. After all, Sarah had already demonstrated she would put her entire career at risk for Chuck in Versus The Colonel, there was no reason to go down the "leaving with Bryce" path or the "will you run away with me/I want to be a spy" path as was demonstrated later in the season. Hell, Versus The Honeymooners showed that 13 episodes of keeping them apart came down to a lack of communication that could have been settled in five seconds.
ReplyDeleteDo you think Sarah would be upset if Chuck quit the CIA? After spending the last 3 years trying to protect him, then falling in love with him, I am sure the last thing she would want is to have him in dangerous situations, after all she was worried enough about him dying to give him her spy will. At the end of Ring II the look on Sarah's face was hard to read. It was either Chucks lying to Ellie again or skepticism as to will Chuck actually quit. I hope the writers loose the lying card so they can not play it again. From a moral standpoint there are children watching that see him lying and just like in real life the lies catch up with lier. After all what Would be so bad about, Ellie I found all of Dads research and he has been protecting mom for all these years however he took her location to his grave, I am going back to work for the CIA use their resources, find her and protect her.
ReplyDeleteBree, I sure hope the writers NEVER make a creative decision based on who might be influenced by the show. That would force characters to do things that make even less sense than they sometimes do. I would not mind it if they eliminated that lying-to-Ellie story device but I don't see why they would set up that ending only to have Chuck go back to his sister to say "Hey... remember when I said I was quitting... well, I found out mom is around and may need our help."
ReplyDeleteOf course, that is what I would do if I were Chuck but then constant lying would make me really tired. I am surprised that Chuck isn't exhausted by it. He does it now without thinking.
I'd be lying if I said all the lying didn't bother me, especially to Sarah and when there's really no need to. Tought he might have learnd his lesson in Fake name. Hope they don't use that device too much next season.
ReplyDeleteI'm going to agree that Sarah's role seemed minimized for most of the last two or three episodes. However, I don't expect it to stay that way. With Ellie having such a huge role in these episodes, they just didn't have enough screen time for more depth in Sarah's role.
ReplyDeleteI doubt that trend will continue into season 4. It's only really been the last 3 episodes where that's been the case, and it's because of the whole Ellie plotline taking a ton of time. Come S4, we'll be back to the usual balance.
Even in the last 3 episodes, it's hardly the case that Sarah's role has been superfluous. Her scenes are still beautiful, they just aren't as relevant to the story as they are most of the time because this particular plotline has revolved around other characters' interactions.
THR has Chuck listed as returning August 16th. Think that's really the case?
ReplyDeletehttp://livefeed.hollywoodreporter.com/2010/05/summer-broadcast-dates-schedule-chart-.html
It would make sense for NBC to rerun the last 6-8 episodes, to get people up the speed and back in "Chuck" Mondays mode.
ReplyDeleteIt can't possibly be live episodes in August. They started filming in July last year and the first episode wasn't even ready for quite a few weeks. They'd have to start filming again this month to pull off new eps. in August. As far as I know, Yvonne is off filming a movie in Australia.
ReplyDeleteI agree that I didn't like how Sarah's character was written this year. I agree with certain aspects. Specifically, how she was an emotional mess after Prague and how close she was to the breaking point after that. I didn't like how we really didn't learn much about her backstory. Even her name reveal (which should have been huge) as fumbled and screwed up. It was pretty much the big reveal for her character this year and it didn't even really mean that much.
Crash