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| Chuck and Sarah in "Seduction Impossible" -- Property of WB |
Chuck's decision to wait puts him at odds with Sarah, who tries to convince him to see things her way.
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Monday, January 24, 2011
CHUCK SPOILER: Seduction Impossible (4.14)
Chuck's decision to wait puts him at odds with Sarah, who tries to convince him to see things her way.
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Chuckpocalypse #123238 in 3, 2, ...
ReplyDelete1. So Chuck's decided to wait on the engagement, eh? Can't say I'm surprised.
ReplyDeleteI really doubt this will cause a Chuckpocalypse as it was telegraphed with a giant neon sign tonight. The only question is wait on what? Proposal? Marriage? or something completely different?
ReplyDeleteOhh, this sounds like fun!
ReplyDeleteWhat else would they do with 11 more episodes?
ReplyDeleteLol. People are already so mad at Chuck. I can't imagine the reaction to him putting it off.
ReplyDeleteNormally your spoilers cause controvercies but you got a dud here. It's not a grenade more like a firecracker. No one in their right mind is going to think Chuck is going to ask Sarah to marry him. They beat this proposal thing into the ground it's hard to get excited about it anymore.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the heads up anyways.
Rac2873
@Sue I know, right? This fandom flips out something fierce when anything angsty happens. It's absolutely nuts!
ReplyDeleteI think Chuck needs to sort out his feelings on how the spy life impacts the personal life.
ReplyDeleteBTW, did anyone really think the proposal was coming next eps? I mean REALLY?
ReplyDelete@Paul: Yeah. I don't think it's a question about his feelings for Sarah. That much has been clear since what.. Season 1? Haha. It's more about how it'll all work within the spylife. I wouldn't be surprised if he doubted himself for still being a spy, or maybe wanting to get out at some time.
ReplyDeleteStill, I'm guessing it's waiting on the engagement/proposal. He still loves her, but the thing with his mom being bad, then good.. Sarah being good, then 'bad', and pushing Casey out of the window.. all too much for our nerd.
The thing about this spoiler is the endless interpretations, as with all your teasers. You could absolutely mean engagement but maybe not. Would you essentially spoil definitively that it is not in 4x13? Something to think about. The grenade could be live or simply a clever dud who's carnage comes from overreaction. You are an enigma, sir.
ReplyDeleteto wait with what?
ReplyDeleteInteresting switcheroo here. First they had Chuck have to prove to Sarah that he hadn't killed somebody, and was still "her Chuck" and now it seems Sarah will have to prove to Chuck that she's still the same Sarah Walker that he's known always and that he fell in love with.
ReplyDeleteThey even foreshadowed it in the beginning of the episode.
So instead of Chuck pursuing Sarah, it seems like it will be the other way around...
Jon
Jon, interesting little tidbit... the original outline for season 3 had Sarah pursuing Chuck. And she had to convince him that they should be together after he found himself unsure of who she was.
ReplyDelete@Magnus - Ahh, interesting. I guess this gives them a chance to implement that plot with the expanding of the season, huh?
ReplyDeleteYet Sarah wants to be with Chuck but then apparantly seduces someone one too easy for Chuck's liking.
ReplyDeleteSo now they want to hit both Chuck and Sarah with the stupid stick. lol
I think it would be nice to see Sarah pursue Chuck. I love how they are mixing it up and I can see Chuck being a little nervous at how Sarah can change it up so quickly.
ReplyDeleteI love this show and Chuck and Sarah.
Me too, ac. Me too.
ReplyDeleteAre Chuck and Sarah going to get on Casey's nerves with their bickering? Or is he going to egg one or both of them on? I miss those days.
ReplyDeleteMagnus said...
ReplyDeleteJon, interesting little tidbit... the original outline for season 3 had Sarah pursuing Chuck. And she had to convince him that they should be together after he found himself unsure of who she was.
So what clown killed that idea? That would have been a much better arc than we got. But that is in the past though there are some parallels. Seems like they are diminishing the Chuck character this episode. I have no issues with what Sarah did but lots with Chuck.
I totally think they will get engaged next episode. I think Sarah willwant to get married immediately & Chuck will want to wait. After all, why would she want a big wedding - who in the world would she invite?
ReplyDeleteI really getting tired of the so called Chuck fans gripping all the time. This is not so bad.
ReplyDeleteFirst.
ReplyDeleteMagnus , thank you, really. Thanks to you, I enjoyed way more better this episode than I expected. It was awesome and Sarah no word . Best line came out from Volkoff " one step closer to the woman that you love " Awesome XD.
But, and I think the first time in my life, I will think rational.
I find this thing or angst whatever you call " cheap "
Cheap, I think this is the right word. and I think even if you not a shipper, this is Cheap,
especially if you not a Shipper, you will find it cheap.
and I think deep inside even you Mangnus, you understood.
and I realy worry, that this story will make Chuck once again prove that he is the most annoying and fool character, and that he is not grow anything in the last 4 years. It was fun in the Santa clause, but now I find it Cheap, if he is doubt about Sarah.
But the episode was awesome , very very good, really, but I find it Cheap.
But your spoiler could be very misleading, so this is not my final judgment
chuck just got awesome again. these next few episodes are going to be so good. THe writers have set up such an amazing story line, i can't wait ot see how it will all pan out. I don't quite understand why everyone is freaking out on chuck and sarah. i wish everyone would just relax and enjoy the show for what it is. Man next week is going to be so good, i wish it was on now. Magnus, you really can't give anything away?? I LOVE THIS SHOW
ReplyDeleteMF
So it seems Chuck is going to postpone the proposal because he's not sure of who she really was. That's interesting. Can't wait to see how this one plays out.
ReplyDeleteI do have a question regarding 4.14 though: is it going to be a lighthearted episode, or is it going to be in the vein of the episodes that preceded it?
On a side note, 4.12 was awesome. I still don't see why people would "lose their ****" over that particular episode. Frustrated, yes, but certainly not enraged. O__O
Quick question, will they have the "at odds" situation sorted by the end of the episode or will it go on for a few more episodes? Thanks
ReplyDeleteThanks Magnus. I thought it might be going that way when I heard about 4.12 from your teases and the synopsis for 4.14. Which I'm glad about, Chuck wanting time 'to process' seems in character for him, I mean the show makes jokes at his expense about his general mopiness now and the extremes he goes to!! Sarah being all in once she has made a decision seems in character also. I've kind of been hoping that this little arc makes Chuck grow up a little bit more in the way he approaches certain things.
ReplyDeletesound of rolling grenade, pssss, poof, a dud, magnus, the crowd the hucksters are playing to have grown tired of contrived couple angst and whininess of the lead , I liked 4x12 by the way, thought sarah was awesome, volkov was awesome, mary was pretty good, jeffster / ellie / awesome had me LOL'ing, but chuck bartkowski, my goodness, he sucks
ReplyDeleteI think Casey is going to set Chuck straight.
ReplyDelete@ac, well Sarah did warn Chuck she had to be her old self for a little bit....but from what I saw, she wasn't at all comfortable with her old self.
ReplyDelete>Anonymous said...
ReplyDelete>Quick question, will they have the "at odds" >situation sorted by the end of the episode or will >it go on for a few more episodes? Thanks
Now that's something I would like to know as well.
To those who say they are more mad at Sarah than Chuck, I think it is silly to be mad at either. These are characters written by people. Don't be mad at anyone. Just watch the show. :)
ReplyDeleteIn any event, on paper what Sarah did at the end sounded worse than it played out. I liked how Yvonne played it. I also liked how Zac played Chuck's confusion.
Some of you sell out these characters at the drop of a hat. "OMG, he was so stupid!" You make no attempt to empathize. Just... it didn't work out the way I wanted it to, SO IT MUST BE STUPID.
I think these last four episodes have been great. And I am sure lots of people agree with me. Yet I go to the Internet and... whaaaaaat? Complaining... complaining... LOVED IT... complaining... LOVED IT... blahblah. In the really real world, no one complains to me about the show. Every single person is happy about it.
Every day the Internet reveals to us why it is still a mostly insignificant tool in judging popularity or audience satisfaction. It is made up of tons of wannabe critics who forget they are not being paid to judge the artistic quality of the show they supposedly love.
Ask your questions in the Chuck You Tuesday Episode 55 posting if you want it answered. I am not searching out questions here when we record the podcast.
ReplyDeleteI am lazy.
I thought 4.11 was boring, but LOVED 4.12. I'm assuming Chuck is "waiting" on the proposal now. I'm probably what you'd call a crazy shipper who wants it sooner rather than later, but this decision makes sense to me. If Sarah is going to take up Mary's 20 year mission, even if she did so out of love for Chuck, how can he be sure she won't take another long term mission in the future? And I agree... I'd love to see Sarah pursuing Chuck for 3 or 4 episodes (not 11, though).
ReplyDeleteConcerning Sarah's seduction in this episode... did I read somewhere (it may have been speculation, not a spoiler) that the team is facing an army of women? This ep. does involve Roan, so I expect lots of beautiful women to be around. Could it be that Chuck is shocked to see Sarah easily seduce another woman?
You are crazy but not because you want the proposal soon. But because you were bored by 4.11. And yes, 4.14 has lots of ladies in it.
ReplyDeleteIf your spec is what it seems (and I am in no way convinced you actually would "spoil" a major plot twist), I don't think it will work.
ReplyDeleteSarah pursuing Chuck in Season 3 could have worked because they hadn't been together. But they have posited Chuck as an all-in kind of guy. His BEING with Sarah but being unsure he wants to marry her is totally implausible as they have written the Chuck character to date.
No one will buy a reluctant Chuck now. At least no one with a brain. Of course, since the relationship has been idiotic since the end of Colonel, what's another stupid plot development? And how many people with a brain really take this show seriously anymore? (Sadly, I wonder where my own brain is since I am still watching the show...)
My spec? I don't spec. And you are banned for life!!!!
ReplyDelete(see, hyperbole works both ways)
Magnus said - "It is made up of tons of wannabe critics who forget they are not being paid to judge the artistic quality of the show they supposedly love."
ReplyDeleteThere is much truth to this. There are fansites that I read that have folks who fall into this category.....hard. While there is nice discussion and interesting analysis at times, many folks fall into the "self-appointed critic" mode. It gets a bit annoying at times.
I think the writers are doing a great job. They are bringing what you don't want but giving you giant goose eggs that they are leading to what you do want. Chuck isn't just marrying Sarah he is also marrying the spy life. Can this nerd marry into a life of deception and killing. Remember Chuck has never actually killed anyone.
ReplyDeleteSo is Chuck having second thoughts about Sarah or the Spy Life? I can not wait to see how the writers sell this one and get Chuck to grow so that he can catch up to Sara's spy skills. I hope Shaw breaks out of prision so Chuck has to kill him this time. Yes my dig to stupid season 3.
Hey look the one thing and only thing negative I will say about this season is that if they cut out cubic z and used that episode to show what sarah did while away for 4 weeks, it would have made this final mini arc more dramatic. But you know what I understand that for whatever reasons TPTB have kept the angst down to an absolute minimum and so we know as an audience that casey will be injured for an episode max and that chuck and sarah will be together at the end of the next episode, so the drama is a little down. I just wished people went for the ride, I know that last season they hit the angst button one too many times and so fans associate that with horrible nightmares and never want to see it again, but it does limit how much build up we can have if stories are not given the appropriate dramatic wieght.....it is like being stuck between a rock and a hard place and now we go back to light episodes and fans are happy but critics are not (except Sepinwall, he just wants chuck and sarah happy), oh let the ride continue....
ReplyDeleteShane, I agree. I want the writers to stop listening to the fans. Stop listening to critics. Write the show the way you would have without their whining. Because there should be much more concern from the audience for the well being of these characters. MORE ANGST is necessary.
ReplyDeleteAgreed completely, Magnus. Shows like this (Drama.. or Dramedy) get their ratings when the show has high-pressure situations, drama, and cliffhangers. That makes people want to come back next week. There's a lot going.. "OH GOD. WILL THEY BREAK UP? Oh no! Does Chuck hate Sarah for nearly killing Casey!?"
ReplyDeleteThat's all retarded to say, obviously.. but some people are really dumb enough to believe that, and then base their opinions on some screen caps. Screen caps are just that... captures of one single moment per picture. Yeah, Chuck's probably irritated in that picture.. but not solely at Sarah I'm sure. They are stuck in chains, in a dungeon, with Pajama Roan sitting right there, Haha.
Anyway, I do love the points you make here. TBH, this show would be better without the rabid fanboys/fangirls watching, but again.. if you remove them, you remove a large chunk of the audience and that stinks. :/
here is a different POV - the problem chuck has one character who has the ability to generate angst, last season, noone cared when chuck had a girlfriend, because, really, sarah say's 'chuck, the closet', and chuck is in the closet with intersect like speed. Casey near dies, I did not read one thing about it today, but people were worried how chuck or sarah would react, now if morgan got killed, that might up the stakes, or even tortured for 3 or 4 episodes, or if alex got a PLI, or if awesome and ellie got divorced or a LI each, if the show is a drama, it needs some drama in it, not just the same single dramatic ploy played between the same two characters over and over and over again.
ReplyDeleteMagnus wrote: "Jon, interesting little tidbit... the original outline for season 3 had Sarah pursuing Chuck. And she had to convince him that they should be together after he found himself unsure of who she was."
ReplyDeletea) it would have been a very good arc on season 3;
b)I had already thought that Sarah's actions would delay the proposal, and I think that's more than ok. The only light problem is that this whole "C/S being apart" + "she might go over to the dark side" seems very rushed, which is obvious because they only had 13 episodes. This whole existential crisis would have played out much better as a longer arc, just as the intersectless-Chuck-arc would have. Well, the world is not made of "would have beens", so I am glad we get the extra episodes even though it was a bit late.
And from what Magnus has been saying, the next episodes sound very promising. Since Magnus hasn't hyped an episode that ended up disappointing me, I believe the second part of season 4 is going to be pretty awesome.
I agree that it would have worked out better if 4.12 was a three episode arc but... it wasn't. Though, it being due to the initial 13 episode order may not be accurate. They knew before episode 9 that they had the order. This is just what this show does a lot of times. It seems to have too many things it wants to do and rushes through things other shows would have spent an entire season on.
ReplyDeleteAnd the next six episodes sound pretty great to me. :)
Agreed. 4.13 looks epic, 4.14 looks hilarious (even if we have some more Chuck and Sarah angst), 4.15 as a group called the Cat Squad? How can you go wrong?!
ReplyDeleteI guess any angst is bad for the fans of the show, though. They know we've been burned before. I just wish people would have faith in what's to come. :/
Ok chuck got a 3.9/6 which I hope is a 2.1 again. Magnus can you call out that dark UFO guy who keeps saying cancel chuck because he is really getting on my nerves!
ReplyDeleteI am going to kick the next person who posts the household numbers!
ReplyDeleteIt got a 2.0 in preliminary ratings. It got the same last week and was bumped up to a 2.1 in the finals. I don't expect that this week. Hopefully, it stays at 2.0.
Yeah, I saw that too. I don't really worry about ratings as a whole unless they're absolutely dreadful (lolCape).
ReplyDelete"It got the same last week and was bumped up to a 2.1 in the finals. I don't expect that this week. Hopefully, it stays at 2.0."
ReplyDeleteBut it gained viewers this week, surely that may bring us up to 2.1 again? no?
BTW wheres my Alex spoiler :P
Yours Truly,
Anonymous
We shall see in the finals. And your Alex spoiler may come sooner or later.
ReplyDeleteI think Chuck was preempted somewhere. So I am not that hopeful for an increase in the final numbers. A 2.0 still isn´t that bad, though.
ReplyDeleteThanks for that new spoiler. I am not sure, if you are really referring to the proposal. After all you didn´t mention it and left the door wide open there.
Mostly I am doubtful, because you mentioned in a comment somewhere, that the characters wouldn´t have a problem with what Sarah did, if Casey told her to do it. And he did tell her to throw her out of the window, which, considering Casey seems to be up and running in 4.14, Chuck should have learned by then.
He might still have a problem with Sarah actually nearly killing Casey, even though that would kind of conflict with you saying, that no one would have a problem with it, if Casey told her to do it, or he might not be happy with Sarah declining his call and distancing herself while undercover. So I guess it could be the proposal.
But the way the spoiler is worded, it could refer to a lot of different arguments.
Fans, when they see stills, or watch promos, or even read my teasers, have tunnel vision. And it is understandable since they don't know what I know. So they will only guess within the limitations they have set for the story. This is where I was always very good at speculating, prior to becoming the greatest spoiler God of all time.
ReplyDeleteI could see beyond what was shown to me. There are several people who comment here who seem to have that special, super cool gift. But they get drowned out by the rest.
Chuck could not only be delaying the engagement for many more reasons that being upset with Sarah, he could also be delaying buying a house with her... or getting an apartment (that doesn't include Morgan), or maybe she wants to have children. I am not saying any of these are what it is about, or if the engagement is delayed due to some misunderstanding... but fans should think outside of that box a tad.
Granted, I may just be saying that so so you don't think of the obvious.
Get an apartment without Morgan! No way, he keeps them communicating and functioning so not cool!
ReplyDeleteYeah. A lot of people see 'decision to wait' following 4.12, and what we just saw, so they immediately thing "Like omg, he's going to delay the engagement because he's mad at Sarah. I mean look.. they're both sitting there and all sad, and I don't see rings, and omgomg".. and that really bugs me.
ReplyDeleteI mean jeez. One.. no rings because they're on a mission having to do with seduction. Two.. we all know how insecure Chuck can get and he's all about wearing his emotions on his sleeve, so for all we know, that scene could be about the seduction Sarah pulled off, or may have to pull off (if it hasn't happened yet), and so on. There's so many other things that could be happening in those stills than just that one thing fans hope it isn't; the engagement being put on hold.
You chose a good time for that little tidbit, by the way, right after 4.12 and all, :D
But yeah, I try to open my tunnel vision a bit and see a wider scope of things instead of jumping to the negatives right off the bat.
Part of the fun is trying to figure out what your spoilers mean. However, the danger to avoid is getting too invested in a speculation theory. When it proves wrong, you end up being disappointed
ReplyDeletePaul, bingo. And it is one of the things the hardcore fans who speculate all the time do way too much. They create expectations based on what they spend hours and hours and hours a week thinking up... and the show can NEVER live up to that. So, you have to be able to divorce yourself from your expectations more times than not.
ReplyDeleteReykeile, and even if the engagement is being put on hold, it would be for a better reason than that. I bring Lethal Weapon up again... who thought that the writers would keep them from moving in together by way of THAT explanation? And who ever imagined that it would not only be believable, but turn out to be one of the most favorite fan moments on the show?
So, I don't ask people to have faith in the writers... but don't behave as if they are idiots. Otherwise, why are you still watching?
OH... and FYI, that picture, if I am not mistaken, IS of the conversation related to the teaser.
Do you think with how the ratings have averaged 1.9-2.0 and in compared to the rest of NBC's hour long scripted programs that a 5th season being better than 50/50, that it changes the story somewhat than it would say if the show was getting a 1.2 and certain cancellation ?
ReplyDelete- morgan's attempted tough guy voice
Ask your darn questions in the appropriate area! Since I do have to fill podcast time. :)
ReplyDeleteHm, so the picture is related? I guess in one of the shots where Chuck seems to be talking with his hands, he's trying to make a point as to why they should go that route. Yeah, I'm not really sitting here, sweating whether things will work out or not. I know it's going to be a long, agonizing process.. what with getting Sarah and MamaB back, but the payoff will be worth it in the end.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the engagement possibly being put on hold, again.. no problem here with me. Granted I'm sort of 'meh' on it since it was a big plot in 4.09 with Sarah finding the plan, and then in 4.11 with the whole last half being about Chuck planning the perfect proposal, along with Sarah and Morgan helping him behind the scenes, then for them to sort of push it back? My only reaction is 'meh'. The writers may not be the greatest at times, but they aren't stupid at all. All of the angst in Chuck usually gives a nice payoff by the end of the angst road as it is, and if I did think they were idiots, I wouldn't be watching.
By the way.. "Lethal Weapon" is a good example. The way the emotion just.. flowed, especially by Sarah's reactions, even if not by words, but by how she looked. The reason for not moving in, because they'd be around each other a lot.. yeah. A great example. Even if they delay the engagement, it isn't that Chuck doesn't want to marry him, or viceversa, as we both know that's silly.. but with everything going on right now, and everything he'd have seen (the whole Volkoff thing/almost killing Casey/assumed seduction (total speculation), then yeah. He's just gotta sort through it like Chuck always does.
Anyway, thanks for the response here, Magnus!
Ok Magnus, I accept your challenge. My GUESSES/thoughts about the next four + episodes. I had to edit this down to be accepted by the character limit.
ReplyDeleteFirst things first, what is going to happen in the “last ten minutes of 4.13?” One thing I think certainly won't happen, is Mama B being successfully extracted from the Volkoff organization. If we learned anything from 4.10, its that bargaining with Volkoff is a zero sum game, in the particular case of 4.10, even less. There is no way both sarah and Mama B come out all easy like. The obvious “twist” would be Mama B sacrificing herself so that Sarah can get out and have a life with Chuck, “take care of him, Sarah.” But I'm guessing there is more to it than that. BTW, Can anyone see Mary living in a house down the road from Chuck, Sarah, Ellie and Devon coming down to visit the family and the baby periodically for the back 11? Because I sure can't.
My guess for 4.14 is that Chuck, like everyone has been speccing above, is learning more about Sarah and doesn't like what he sees. Her erratic behavior in 4.12, 4.13, and then seducing a target in 4.14 Chuck feels like he no longer understands her. In Vs the cougars Chuck was content saying “I don't need to know more, not about who you were... I know who you are” Now that Chuck wants to marry her, this isn't enough. Like in vs the third dimension he can't get the image of the violent, erratic, scary person Sarah is who (this time) very nearly killed Casey. He needs reassurance about who Sarah really is.
Whether they propose or not in 4.13 doesn't really matter, Chuck can have second thoughts about marriage even when they are engaged. But I really don't think they are going to.
Sarah is now hurting inside, bad. Just in 4.11 Chuck was spilling his heart out for her and giving her an epically romantic proposal, and now he is a little cold and distant, trying to cope with her recent actions. Sarah is wondering what the spy life means to her, whether she likes any part of it anymore, giving some truth to what she said in the beginning of 4.12. But, what does perfectly planned TV give her? Her old glory team she used to live for! She finds refuge in a little more of her old self. Again, Chuck sees this and has a hard time coping. Carina makes some fun of Sarah, relieved that the “real” life isn't working out so perfectly for Sarah. In the end Sarah finds emptiness. She is deeply disheveled that Chuck is slipping away from her and that even the best of her old life can't fill the void.
Que next episode, and we have a PLI. No arguing, that's what it is. Another brunette, beautiful girl that Chuck could easily fall for. What's more? He can help this girl! Contrast from Sarah, deeply connected with a million dark things, is an innocent girl who (supposedly) can't understand that her father is actually a very bad man. NOW, remember what P stands for, Potential. I would be extremely surprised if the writers allow this PLI turn into an LI. What does this girl bring instead? A serious wake up call for Sarah. Memories of Jill, Hannah, and now this exceedingly pretty brunette who is beautiful, charming, intelligent and studying at oxford (from spoilertv.com, under NBC/Chuck 4.16 casting call). This time she makes her stand, she will have none of Chuck getting involved with this woman.
This time around we see what should have happened in the beginning of season 3, angst that everyone can love that is worthy of season 4 being the last we see of Chuck on TV.
I thought there was some outside the box thinking in there...
Paul, maybe I do get too involved. But I certainly enjoy it. I have been wrong about 95% of the time but I am certainly not disappointed. And just FYI, Magnus this took me from finishing the episode at 10:30PST until now to think up. (~2 hours, response to your "hours and hours" theory) I am looking forward to anything and everything the awesome writers we are lucky to have have in store, especially if I am wrong.
Kevin
Also a side note, for some reason (apart from honeymooners) more dramatic episodes get more sexy sexy for our two adorable leads, think about it....salami, seduction, colonel, fear of death, phase three, gobbler, etc. All these dramatic episodes get more intimate and hot scenes between chuck and sarah. So fans should route for more drama, it makes the hot payoff all the better....just saying!
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone really expect Chuck to pop the question before ep4.24? That's got to be the new season 4 climax. If there is a season 5 then the wedding will be that season's climax.
ReplyDeleteTS
Just so you all know, I'm guessing the proposal will be 4.17 or 4.18 but I'm more going for 4.17. Just putting it out there.
ReplyDeleteMabalsa Ritchie.
Chuck dropped to a 1.9. That sucks.
ReplyDeleteBTW, the drama queens are already making their "I'm quitting the show" threats.... lol
ReplyDeleteWell Magnus, I've proven that I don't have that super cool "gift of spec". Heck, I was positive that Shaw was coming back this episode because I heard it in the music you played. Thanks for not laughing - out loud ;-)
ReplyDeleteWhen talking about 4.13, you keep bringing up Lethal Weapon and usually mention the last scene at the fountain. I keep going back to the price Chuck pays - I wonder if his badass self is going to wreck havoc on him. I'm wondering if Chuck is not liking what he had to become, or do, in order to be the hero. Chuck's self doubt is strong to begin with and if he loses sight of who he has become or is becoming, that would indeed be out of the box fans have created for what happens next.
Sigh, I know, over thinking it again. Keeps my mind occupied on a rough day.
perhaps with the latest events Sarah wants to leave the spy life and just having a quiet life with Chuck and he will not. very out of character?
ReplyDeleteJoanna
My issues with the episode and in general I liked it a lot as it does set up the next episode well are two fold and I can't give a final verdict till after 4.13. That is similar to what some folks expressed after FOD as well. They are almost 2 part episodes and the setup one can seem off till you get the payoff.
ReplyDeleteBut my 2 things 1 small and one not so small are these. First the small. The phone call decline plot device has been used too many times before. Be creative and do something new to amp up the drama(angst).
Second what I didn't like was in the early part of the episode Chuck seemed to be trying to convince himself that Sarah would not change. That his mind was talking to his gut rather than his gut talking to his mind. After Phase Three and Balcony IMO he should know his woman on a gut level and know that she wouldn't change even after what he saw her do later on. His first instinct should be to think there must be an explanation and not just immediately have doubts. This is where it needs to be played out next week. They left that up to interpretation. Is Chuck questioning Sarah or is he going to instinctively believe that there is a good explanation that there was a plan involved and then blame Volkoff for making Sarah do it and go after him. They hint that in the promo and if that is the case I'm ok with it and it worked but if they have him questioning her it doesn't for me.
So I will need to see how it plays out in the end but the thing I'm most excited about is what does the showdown in Orion's cabin mean to the story. That really intrigues me.
Thinking out of the box.. I guess you are right Magnus...! I think what you spoiled here it's not about the engagement at all would be too easy..it can be everything...!But maybe I think so because I'm rooting for the proposal in 4x13, not only because I'm a shipper (or a crazy one as you like to think) but also 'cause I think this delaying the proposal is going too out of control! I mean Sarah saw the ring and stuff she has only to say YES..! Besides I consider the proposal matter inside the midseason arc so they should close it and move on.. not necessarly with a wedding at the end..(there are engagement that lasts for years)! Chuck will be surely confused for what Sarah did but it's sure that as soon as Casey wakes up will explain the truth more or less like what he did on Chuck's red test!
ReplyDeleteWell thanx for teasing Magnus...always a pleasure reading...=)
I definitely can't wait for 4x13 and 4x14!
S.
@Kevin, you just recreated the season 3 plot line...but in reverse...lol.... I don't think they'll attempt that considering how it almost burned them least season.
ReplyDeleteMy guess is that Volkoff is killed next eps. And I think it's Frost who does it. The engagement will be put on hold, but it's because Chuck needs to sort out his feelings on how the spyworld impacts his personal life. I think Sarah will push for it. But it's not going to be angsty or dark (as DR stated). I think the two will work out their issues and be ready by 4.15.
Just a clarification about my spec statement earlier: there is nothing wrong with spec'ing. It's a lot of fun. However, you have to look at it the right way. To me, a spec is a diagnosis (yes I work in the medical field) based on the evidence you have gathered. It may be right or it may be wrong. But you have to be flexible to accept if you are wrong. The big kick I get out of speccing is seeing how close to the mark I get when the eps finally plays. Being wrong is part of the game and oftentimes half the fun.
ReplyDeleteKevin I hope that doesn't happen. I could not be any less emotinally invested in that storyline if I tried.
ReplyDeleteMorgan in drag? Is that somehow part of Chuck's plan? I can't see him making a very convincing woman. Especially with the beard.
ReplyDeleteOh, come on, Magnus. They really couldn't kill off Chuck and rename the show "Sarah", could they? You were joking about that in the podcast, weren't you?
ReplyDeleteOk, so, it seems I am already wrong about a big part of my guess. Read the 4.14 summary if you are ok with spoilers.
ReplyDelete“@Kevin, you just recreated the season 3 plot line...but in reverse...lol.... I don't think they'll attempt that considering how it almost burned them least season.”
It is my belief that they have learned from season 3 and will not write a Chuck/Sarah relationship problem arc in a disappointing way like they did last season. However I have no doubt that they are willing to put another significant bump in the road. Some people think the proposal will happen later in the season, and if thats true there has to be bumps in the road.
“But it's not going to be angsty or dark (as DR stated)”
I don't know what you are referring to. but if he said that, believe him. for your own sake.
“[when speccing] you have to be flexible to accept if you are wrong ”
Done. And that goes for all of you!
“Kevin I hope that doesn't happen. I could not be any less emotionally invested in that storyline if I tried.”
All (I meant) to suggest is that the proposal won't happen in 4.13 or 4.14 due to chuck's hesitation, Sarah will be down in the dumps and will be taking the things Chuck says about who she is to heart, and she will do a double-take when she sees this beautiful brunette, who is tailor made by the writers for Chuck to be interested in.
and some stuff about Sarah's old team giving her perspective on who she is. And that's about it. Take it or leave it.
Kevin
ooooh yes. and I spec, with my little brain... something about the end of episode 4.13!
ReplyDeletesweet new intersect anyone? maybe we will see something of the new intersect there. my idea: Stephen J Bartowski anticipated the emotionalness of his sweet little boy and the dastardly effects his emotions can have on the intersects ability to function, and patched the intersect to throw them in reverse? What if Chuck's emotions mean the end... for his enemies?
impossible? plausible?
Kevin
Magnus, I will disagree on one point - people on other websites and fanblogs *coughchuckthiscough* are being drama queens in regards to this eps. Some folks are already chiming in with their threats to quit watching.
ReplyDeleteLooking at the interwebz most of the reaction to the episode wasn't anywhere near as bad as I thought it would be. Then I had a look at the imdb message boards and some of the complaining and whining about what I thought was a 90% brilliant episode is great, yay for crazies.
ReplyDelete"Sarah pursuing Chuck in Season 3 could have worked because they hadn't been together. But they have posited Chuck as an all-in kind of guy. His BEING with Sarah but being unsure he wants to marry her is totally implausible as they have written the Chuck character to date."
ReplyDeleteTo Anonymous: If you don't know that Chuck has major abandonment issues then we've been watching different shows. Her "changing" and extended absence from his life only reinforces those feelings.
Why do people care so much when Sarah and Chuck tie the knot? That's going to be the most boring episode ever. All this talk about a when he's going to propose and when the wedding is going to be is making me sick. Are we watching a soap or primetime. I'm thinking they're going a little too heavy on the drama lately.
Crash
Yeah, I wasn't looking at comments on sites I ignore now... so, I missed the melodrama from those. But no one should be surprised and I have no idea why any reasonable fan even reads those sites. Unless you really enjoy listening to misery.
ReplyDeleteCompletely agreed with you, Crash. I can't believe how it slips people's minds that Chuck sort of has abandonment issues too. He was raised by his sister..since both his mom and dad abandoned them quite early on in their lives (Chuck and Ellie). He's lucky to be as sane as he has been for his whole life. He made it to college at Stanford where... well, look at that. He was abandoned by his best friend Bryce and his girlfriend. Yet even after all of THAT, he still manages to keep it together for the most part.
ReplyDeleteSo yeah. Sure, Chuck *should* trust Sarah more based on her super undercover mission to rescue MamaB, even with her almost killing Casey and not keeping contact with him there at the end of the episode, but he's been burned SO much in his life. You can't blame the guy for letting those insecurities back in sometimes, especially when it's as major as an engagement to someone. I'm sure he just wants to learn more about Sarah, which in turn will teach us, the viewers, more about Sarah.
I wish people would stop going 'I'm gonna quit watching if he doesn't propose by 4.13 WAAAAH".. -- this is a Dramedy, not a soap opera. We don't need married Chuck and Sarah to have fun. I could deal without the manufactured angst (ignoring the phone call from Chuck), but we should be used to that by now.
@Crash - Well drama can be good. I liked this last eps's drama. The intensity and real consequences was great. I think the show finds a good balance between light and heavy eps.
ReplyDeleteAs for Chuck and Sarah, their relationship and it's evolution has been one of the core themes of the entire show. It is only natural to want to see it move towards that direction. The problem I have with the fanbase is they are in DEMAND mode now. They want it to happen and they wanted it yesterday. And when they don't get it, they pout, throw temper tantrums and threaten to quit watching.
@Kevin - It's been put out that 4.14 and 4.15 are more in the vein of Honeymooners and Role Models. IMHO that means not so much in plot similarties but in feel. Those two eps were very lighthearted and funny, even when Chuck and Sarah had a disgreement about living arrangements and a spat during the mission, it wa still fun and done for comedic effect. So I don't expect heavy relationship drama in the vein of say American Hero or Other Guy.
@Eagle - I just wish the folks who keep threatening to quite watching just shut up and do it. If the show is'nt doing it for you anymore, why make a scene? Just cut ties and go your own way.
I think a lot of fans don't pay attention to the show. They just fantasize about a show that this one isn't and has never been.
ReplyDeleteMagnus, I read other sites because I like to see what other people are thinking, and maybe they saw something that I missed or didn't think about in a different way. Some sites have better insight than others (slthough sometimes they can go a bit overboard on their analysis). The problem becomes when site members succumb to group think, which has been rearing it's ugly head again.
ReplyDeletePaul, most sites succumb to group think because people don't want to be singled out as being an outsider. So, if the site is generally negative, you will almost always see negativity. The same goes for the opposite, except a negative opinion will still dominate the discussion.
ReplyDeleteThat is why you need a strong willed person who happily attacks negativity. Granted, if you just attack negativity without reason, then you are just being a fanboy. So, paying attention to the show and being able to argue from authority is key. Many of these negative sites don't argue from authority. They just argue from the rage created by their unrealistic expectations.
Preaching to the choir Magnus.....
ReplyDeleteI just think deep down honeymooners broke the fanbase and critics. All EVERYONE wants these days including some critics is every episode to be is honeymooners. Where all chuck and Sarah do is smile at each other, hug, kiss, cuddle, agree with each other and it to be all fun and no angst and drama. When fans and critics do not get that, they complain. To be fair honeymooners especially the Nina Simons chuck and Sarah cuddle will always hold a special place for me as a fan, but I understand that we cannot have episodes like that all the time!
ReplyDeletePaul, intended for the benefit of those reading what we say who may not be converted.
ReplyDeleteAmrit, sounds like how critics talked about LOST doing another "The Constant." These episodes are special for a reason. I also think Colonel ruined the first 13 episodes of season 3 for people... and they weren't truly happy until Honeymooners and then waited until Phase Three to be happy again.
ReplyDeleteI feel sorry for them.
4.15 Short Synopsis
ReplyDeleteAfter Chuck reunites Sarah with her former spy team, old grudges and secrets are revealed; Morgan fends off the advances of a former flame.
Thoughts ?
First off, I didn't realize you answered my question until about a half hour ago when I caught up on the podcast, and oh lord. Was my name that hard? I guess I should register something that's actually.. a word, but oh well. It's "Rye-Kee-lee".. at least that's how I go about pronouncing it. I blame myself for making it back when I was in high school and wanted to go for unique.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, Colonel really spoiled a lot of people as far as the Chuck and Sarah relationship goes. People go on to expect their relationship to be perfect, and the worst drama/angst out of them was supposed to be with the First Fight bit, but name a regular relationship that doesn't have issues every now and again? Then go add to the fact that they're both spies, one being undercover while looking for the other's mom, and.. yeah. Can't expect a 'perfect' relationship, or it'd just be boring.
Also, I actually don't mind the not-so-passionate kisses since I figure with them dating, it's to be understood that they do all the heavy stuff behind closed doors now instead of having huge passionate scenes like we were used to last season. That's what I tell myself, anyway. Not to say certain kisses should have way more passion behind them (reunion in 4.12 after so long being one of them), but I don't really try to pay too much attention there.
Ah well, really excited for 4.13.. and 4.15. You mentioned naked Carina. That's enough for me to know it's a must-watch.
Rykeile, I have never kissed a woman with such a lack of passion, even to say hello. It is just... lame. The kiss in 4.11 that I talked about on the podcast wasn't hot, but it was what I expect from people in love. Little pecks don't say "I am soooo in love." At least not to me. Put your lips into it, actors!
ReplyDeleteI agree Magnus! Since actors say their emotions are disconnected and it is just a job, I say then go crazy! Kiss like you never kissed because.....it is just a job! But I think it must be the director, editor, EP's who tone it down. I know telling you something you already know!
ReplyDeleteHaha. Well, true, true. These are actors, and you'd expect them to act. Makes you wonder if there's some pushback from the acting side of things to 'tone down' the kissing? I have no clue. I just take what they give us. I do miss some of their older kisses... like heck, their kiss in Season 1. That was awesome.
ReplyDeleteThey have had some really boring-side-of-the-lip kisses, though. See.. now you're going to get me to pay closer attention to them. Gah!
The producers seem to want these lame kisses. If they made passionate kisses hotter, I wouldn't mind, but even the passionate kisses are understated.
ReplyDeleteOh well, I don't want to beat this thing to death too much.
I just can't deal with a blog or message board with people declaring the writers BETRAYED us at various points. I mean...WHAT? First of all that is creepy and weirdly boundary crossing. Second, it's their show they write what they want, what they think will be entertaining and yes they listen to feedback from fans but it's not your job and lot in life to set them back on the straight and narrow if they don't always succeed.
ReplyDeleteAlso I don't think its fair when I have to debate you and your imaginary casual veiwer friends.
"Also I don't think its fair when I have to debate you and your imaginary casual veiwer friends."
ReplyDeleteSue, I wish I could give you an award for that comment. :)
Heh. Sorry for the rant dude. It's just, lately, grrr trying to talk to some people. It's like, head meet wall, you'll become good friends.
ReplyDeleteYeah. I have a habit of ranting too, Sue, especially on all things 'Chuck'. If it's not one thing, it's another with fans and what they want. You can't please everybody.
ReplyDeleteFunny thing is, the heaviest pettingv session so far this season was in a dream...... go figure. :o)
ReplyDeleteI was reading through, and I saw stuff from magnus about group think, then stuff about moderating from a place of authority, then people latching on to this kiss stuff magnus has been talking about. with great power comes great responsibility, I liked how you shut that group thought down.
ReplyDelete(yeah second person third person, same diff)
One thing I think viewers should realize is that we are seeing just as juicy Chuck and Sarah scenes in episodes like 4.12 as we saw in 3.14. i LOVED the scene at the bread truck. all I could see was two people who wanted more than anything just to go someplace and be together, and couldn't bear to be apart. What more did we see in honeymooners that was so epic on an emotional level? We saw some passionate kisses, some sexy spying, etc. but to me their emotional bond wasn't nearly as palpable as what we have seen in 4.11 and 4.12. This is good, good stuff.
Kevin
Great podcast. One of the things I love is that you three are always having a good time. Even if you find something to critique, you do it in a fun way. It's a good counteragent to all the fan-created angst on other forums.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I want to take a stab at your teaser:
"Chuck's decision to wait puts him at odds with Sarah, who tries to convince him to see things her way."
It's about wine, not whining. Chuck and Sarah liked one of the wines from the tasting so much that they had a case shipped back.
As any wine connosseur knows, the decision on whether to drink a wine now or store it until its at its peak readiness is a big one.
The perfectionist that Chuck is, he wants to wait. Sarah wants to open a bottle and drink it now.
It's quite a debate.
Am I right?
Magnus, DR, master of all things Chuck,
ReplyDeleteOnce again another great podcast!!!
I'm happy with where the show is going.
I hope you will answer these questions about ep4.13.
1) It looks like Chuck and Volkoff are in the same cabin Chuck's dad ran off to make another intersect control watch. Is it the same place or are they recycling sets?
2) Is Hydra a project Chuck's dad worked on?
TS
dkd, you are pretty close... without being remotely close.
ReplyDeleteTS, you are just going to have to wait 5-days to find out. :)
Somehow I knew that would be your answer.
ReplyDeleteIt would be ironic that Steven B would try so hard to hide his secrets only for Chuck to find out that Volkoff knew about them all along.
TS
"dkd, you are pretty close... without being remotely close."
ReplyDelete"the decision on whether to drink a wine now or store it until its at its peak readiness is a big one."
Epic. were you going for that parallel, dkd? or was that an accident?
K
J guesses ...
ReplyDelete- The " torn poster moment " reveal will come at the cabin
- The Sarah and Casey moment will come in the hospital after baby Clara arrives ( lots and lots of tears from Yvonne/Sarah )
- 4.13 will be the bees knees
and ...
The Drive-thru at McDonalds will actually GIVE me 10 McNuggets instead of 9 the next time I go !!
what do you mean by the torn poster moment?
ReplyDeleteJ is spelling deficient. TRON poster moment.
ReplyDeleteIt was one of my teaser spoilers. It happens in the next episode.
I forgot about the TRON poster teaser !!! Yeah It's going to be really hard to top ep4.13
ReplyDeletePoor writer...
TS
Wait tron poster moment? Is it that sarah looks at the back or just they get rid of it or swap it with something they both want? What was the exact teaser Magnus?
ReplyDeleteJ feels shame ...
ReplyDeleteFor not giving TRON the proper treatment it deserves :(
I blame my ipad for not auto-correcting the incident . Clearly Apple still has some bugs to work out
K--
ReplyDeleteI like wine. I have a white burgundy that I paid a lot for from a vintage year that I'm still waiting for the charts to say "drink now".
So, I wait.
Artimus, go watch the end of Lethal Weapon. Now, imagine such a type of moment. Now transport yourself 5-days into the future. Tron-poster-moment.
ReplyDeleteJ says ..
ReplyDeleteI'm eager to see when and how the TRON poster moment will be revealed .
I can see it happening in the beginning when Chuck eventually gets the " Hydra " intel off Casey , being a catalyst for Chuck to set things in motion .
Or, also at the end when everything seems to wrapped up , then something happens and we get a " whoa " type moment which would kind of set up a new arc in the back 11 .
I'm getting goosepimples just thinking about the eventual moment .
Though I'm kind of half expecting Chuck to find a kind of icicle shaped crystal at the cabin that can then be inserted into a machine, bringing up a holographic image of Orion's head which he would be then able to ask questions about certain things ... lol
Now people will build the moment up in their heads and it will not live up to that... and be a massive disappointment. ;)
ReplyDeleteMagnus, it seams to me that you've mentioned Lethal Weapon way too many times lately for it not to be a significant clue as to how things progress in 4.13.
ReplyDeleteSo at this point I think that there will be a good reason why the engagement doesn't happen this week, one that even shippers will embrace( not sure about the crazy shippers).I don't see it being because Chuck thinks Sarah has changed. That would be ridiculous, once he finds out what really happened
My guess: this is a reference to Chuck being a mastermind. in the podcast you said that "Chucks badassness is not in his ability to kick ass its in his ability to smart ass"
ReplyDeleteThe tron poster is us finding out that Chuck has been doing his research on Volkoffs organization all along, since he began with substantial work on it in Anniversary. He was aided by his access to his dads files, one of which is Hydra. Now Chuck also now has a crucial component, the piece of the smashed database eye.
Tron Poster moment + Chuck being a badass (mastermind) in the next episode = a reveal that Chuck has been catalouging Volkoffs organization all along, figuring out how it works and his vulnerabilities.
Furthermore I think the writers liked how they wrote Chuck all mastermind-y in the ring part 2. I think they like pointing out that "before the intersect, he was smart". it worked really well in the ring part two and they want to do it again.
just a guess.
Kevin
Johnny, well part of why I have referenced Lethal Weapon so much is because it is on my mind due to what is happening in 4.13. Plus, it is a great example of how much the fandom freaked out over Beefcake and were then swearing up and down how "Chuck and Sarah better move in together OR ELSE" and then the moment arrived and... people forgot all about their preconceived notions.
ReplyDeleteSo, a great ending, with a believable reason behind a surprise, can shift perceptions and needs. I have little doubt that no matter what you want, or demand happen at the end of 4.13, that you will forget all about it when the episode is over... and you will just sit there going "WOW. That... was... amazing."
so... no comment on my comment?
ReplyDeletea little additional spec: if Chuck has been examining the volkoff organization, Sarah has been in on it. She was oddly specific when she said to casey: "Get this to Chuck", referring to the eye piece. any other time it would have been "Get this to beckman for analysis". why does she specifically want Chuck to have it? I'm guessing Sarah is in on it.
Kevin
Yeah. See, Magnus, I've learned to temper my excitement on a lot of things I watch or play, whether it's TV, movies, or video games. I'm going into 4.13 as I do any other Chuck episode, and that is excited in general for a new episode. Not so much for the 'most epic ten minutes of Chuck ever', but just because I enjoy watching Chuck weekly.
ReplyDeleteI do remember how everyone was up in arms about "Chuck and Sarah better move in together OR ELSE" and then Lethal Weapon ended and people were like.. "Holy crap.. that was amazing." So yeah, if the end of 4.13 makes anywhere near the impact that Lethal Weapon made on me.. I'm not worried at all. I also predict an amazing song choice that I'll have to scavenge the internet for later on.
I really don't need an engagement to keep me enthralled in the show. There's just so much going on that I want to see, and I can't wait to see Chuck go all mastermind on Volkoff. Maybe see Chuck make a 'real' threat, as Volkoff puts it.
Zac will be singing the TANGLED song at the Oscars... so, that should be a nice bit of exposure for him. I wonder if it will have any effect on ratings for CHUCK.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I just heard he'll be singing. So let's count all the reasons to watch the Oscars... yeah. That's the only one!
ReplyDeleteHey that is a good bit of information Magnus, I do wonder if Zac's Tangled song wins, does he get a trophy or does he share it with Mandy Moore or does the EP's of Tangled take it. Wow he could win an Oscar, that is great exposure for him! It could be a great award and the stepping stone for him to become a fixture at the Oscars and a movie career, good things for a great guy!
ReplyDeleteZac will not get a trophy if the song wins. He is just the performer. But he gets to stand on stage and sing it in front of many millions around the world.
ReplyDeleteWell Tangled has almost hit 420 million dollars and the ratings are the same, I so hope so!
ReplyDeleteJohn, no one saw Zac in TANGLED. They WILL see him on stage.
ReplyDeleteAw, good for Zac. Great exposure for his talent. I just wish I liked that song better.
ReplyDeleteWill they allow him to plug Chuck, even just like one sentence? "Watch me in Chuck, NBC mondays at nine?"
ReplyDeletemore spitballs: maybe the new intersect instead of adding abilities, adds some essential information, like the files from the basement that his dad though might get destroyed.
Kevin
Hi!
ReplyDeleteDo you know who has written 413ep?
Nena
One switcheroo could be that the Orion cave was all a decoy and the REAL intel was at the cabin the whole time.
ReplyDeletein one of the promo's for tangled, the interviewer asked mandy moore if she would appear on chuck, her answer was noone has asked her, zach asked if she would, she said she would love to ... Magnus, with all your connections, make that happen please - LOL - I don't have the promo link handy, but I will try to dig it out if anyone is interested
ReplyDeleteJason, even if I had connections like that, I wouldn't use them to put her on the show (even if I would love to see her on it). I think Zac could easily make that happen on his own.
ReplyDeleteNena, 4.13 is written by everyone's favorite writing team.
ReplyDeleteplease please please tell me that Phil Klemmer is writing 4.15 please please please
ReplyDelete- please
Klemmer is not writing an episode until... I think 4.18.
ReplyDelete.. lejudkins? who?
ReplyDeleteLauren LeFranc and Rafe Judkins... come on, they have names. Use them like intelligent people.
ReplyDeleteWOW great news!!!
ReplyDeleteThanks
Nena
I'm not expecting a proposal next week, but it is still a definite possibility. This whole chuck waiting thing could mean anything. Sarah could want to get married immediately and Chuck doesn't. I love CS but people saying that they refuse to watch because of one bump in a relationship is a F***ing joke. of course CS are great but, the reason you love them is because of the story and the world that these writers developed. 24/7 CS fluff would boring and doomed to cancellation. This isn't one tree hill. this is chuck.
ReplyDeleteI hope they just quit the show. Go away if you can't handle bumps in the road. Goodbye, fair weathered "fans." We don't need you. Oh, you are going to take your ratings with you? Good. Do it now. Go away. Buh... bye.
ReplyDeleteCough... no expletives (curse words) here, please. We save that for the podcast. :)
ReplyDeleteYeah, sorry about that. I let that particular site get the best of me, I suppose. Well throw in an extra explative int he next podcast for me. I'd appreciate it.
ReplyDeleteAnyway.. Just looking forward to next Monday.
Why won't they just QUIT?! WHY?!
ReplyDeleteBecause they love to threaten to quit. They are drama queens.
in the* Cursed typos. They sneak up on me.
ReplyDeleteAnd I don't know why they won't quit. I'd rather them stop watching than threaten every week that they don't get their blessed Chuck/Sarah engagement. I mean.. okay, say they get engaged in a couple episodes. What's next? "Like omg, when are they gonna get married?!" and then "When is Sarah getting pregnant?" I mean.. and I'm being 100% honest here, I've seen that get thrown around. What. the. heck.
John Lovitz needs to be on Chuck. That is all.
ReplyDeleteThanks Magnus for the writers info. I'm excited that its them and not Fedak this time. I think their work as script editors this season is why it has been consistently strong all year.
ReplyDeleteBack to the Lethal Weapon thing. I was not part of the online Chuck community back then and never read anything about the show, just watched it week to week. I never wanted Chuck and Sarah to move in as it was fake and it needed to happen when it was real. So I was thrilled when it happened that way because it was the right thing to do for both of them. Then we get two great moments. Chuck telling Sarah he would live the life that he wants with the girl that he loves and Sarah's hopeful glance. Then the Tron poster. A huge positive surprise that Chuck was more than an unwilling participant in all this.
In 4.13 maybe we learn that Chuck AND Sarah have been using Orion's cabin all along and that Volkoff's offsite storage facility has actually been redirected to another underground server complex that Orion built under the cabin. Remember the cabin consumed an incredible amount of electricity. We never saw anything in the cabin that did outside of a computer work station setup. Nothing big there. But what comsumes an incredible amount of electricity? Cooling for a data storage facility along with many servers. Like in the pics from the episode. The piece that Sarah specifically says to get to Chuck is the key to activate the data that he, Mary and Orion have stolen from Volkoff.
From that facility Chuck then begins dismantling Volkoff and we get the final showdown. Chuck once again surprises us with his smarts and becomes the hero once again.
Does that work for you?
magnus you are going to f***ing answer this. Is volkoff killed off in the next eppisode. I am being very confident.
ReplyDeletejamie
I think the reason why so many are wanting the engagement to happen sooner then later is because it has been happening since ep3 of season 4. That's like 10 episodes of waiting and wanting, and for them to be so close in ep11 I don't see the big point in making the viewers wait until a much later episode for it to happen.
ReplyDeleteIt will happen when it happens.
ReplyDeleteI'm starting to hope it doesn't happen until the last 10 seconds of 4x24 and that it's the least romantic proposal ever.
ReplyDeleteChuck: "Here"
(Throws Sarah the ring)
Sarah: "Thanks"
(They smile at each other from 10 feet away)
The End
Ok one more thing has got me thinking but all this is probably wrong and I don't want to spoil it for myself if I'm even partly right lol. The larger Tron poster teaser is because he would need a larger one to cover the hidden entrance to the underground server room at Orion's cabin. He has been working on this since he learned about it from Intel in the Laptop. Mary said his father didn't want him to see this but she knew he was wrong. She set his brain up for the re-intersecting with the PSP knowing that the info he needed to gain access to the hidden complex at the cabin was contained in the laptop upgrade to the Intersect. All this was known to her because she had been in contact with him at that same 1 square meter. It is the over arching arc to get them to that server room for the final showdown. Orion, Mary, Chuck, Morgan and Sarah The Bartowski's if you will, team up in that way to take down the network and the man. Brains, guts and family.
ReplyDeleteSorry for the rambling. If nothing else it might be a fun fanfic. ;)
Thank you for the great podcast, I enjoyed it a lot. First time listener here and I'll definitely will come back for more.
ReplyDeleteI am not too concerned with the engagement, if they choose to stall it, I am sure they come up with a good reason for it.
The fans waited a lot longer for them to get together in the first place, I am sure they can wait a bit longer to see them engaged.
The viewers have stuck around before, the ones who wanted to quit, quit a long time ago. Making stupid threats is serving nobody's best interest, not even the fans'.
Hopefully some of them will wander over here and get some sense into their heads.
Melrache
Little surprised that Fedak didn't write 4.13. So, same rotation as before?
ReplyDelete4.14 Wootton
4.15 Newman
4.16 Myers
Etc.
-Manuel
Melrache, welcome on-board the unsinkable ChuckGasmic! Enjoy the ride.
ReplyDeleteManuel, this is purely from memory, but I think before the pickup, 4.13 was going to be Fedak and someone else. Now, I believe 4.14 is Fedak and Newman.
Sue, let us hope that is how it is. ;)
Y'know, I'm still not convinced that Orion and Frost were ever in contact. And if they were, I doubt it was face to face. I could see scenario that Frost sent Orion something on Hydra and he began to research it deeper. It could also be he found out what it was and was going to finally bring Frost home when he was killed.
ReplyDeleteHey Magnus,
ReplyDeleteDo you know if the Chuck people will be at Wondercon this year? I think last year it was in April, so chuck will be around at that time....
I don't know but I wouldn't be surprised if they are there.
ReplyDeleteYou know wondercon last year showed that the fans that complain are a very small internet minority. Because last year after other guy aired all these crazy shippers online were saying....oh it was not worth the wait and is this all we got, 5 minutes of chuck and sarah and this sucks and blah, blah, blah....but at wondercon not one fan complained or did not seem unhappy with what went down...so it is great to see the actors out there and fans are generally nice people, so I think you are right Magnus, TPTB should just ignore these crazy people! They are just a sad and pathetic tiny internet group!
ReplyDeleteI do wonder what will make fans happy at the next wondercon, I mean can they top last years "so we know they will now!" and Zach's response "so are you shippers satiated now" LOL......
Mike, I have been preaching that for a while. Stop listening to the crazy shippers. Just do what is best for the story telling process as a whole.
ReplyDeleteThis isn't real life.
So, all these ppl who's whining ''oh sarah and chuck are mean to each other'', no one is mean, and cmon, u think their gonna break up or something is gonna happen to them? the show Chuck ur watching, in the end it ALWAYS turns out good, i mean if an episode ends with a cliffhanger i just think for myself ''it's chuck, what could possibly happen''... Geez is it so hard to understand that? :D
ReplyDeleteJack
Magnus,
ReplyDeleteI forgot to thank you for the spoiler/teaser you gave me on your podcast. Morgan must go crazy in ep4.15 with Casey, Alex, and Carina.
He is going to need both Chuck and Sarah for protection ;)
TS
Since now Comcast has taken over NBC and controls quite a few cable channels as a result from the acquisition . Could you foresee a kind of backdoor deal where Comcast would get a lower than low licensing fee from WB for a 5th season and in return Comcast would buy a syndicated package of CHUCK for X amount of years for X amount of $$ ?
ReplyDeleteOr is that even legal ?
Oh , ♥ your site by the way
Anonymous™
I'm not Magnus, but I'd like to tack Anonymous's question.
ReplyDeletePrior to the merger, Comcast did own some cable networks (e.g. E!, G4), but NBCU already owned bigger ones (e.g. USA, Syfy). But, Comcast was primarily in the carriage business.
When Chuck goes into sale as reruns, it could be sold to any cable network. It also could be syndicated to broadcast stations. Some shows have their reruns shown on both.
Unless Comcast buys some part ownership with WB, any revenues from the aftermarket sale of Chuck repeats goes directly to WB. WB even has a syndication division (WB Syndication).
IMO, the networks NBCU already owned are more likely networks that would buy Chuck rerun rights. Syfy comes first to mind.
In the back of my mind I've always asked, "would Chuck reruns even get high ratings for whoever buys them?"
Episodic procedurals shows like Law & Order and NCIS are the kinds of shows that do well in rerun syndication. Serials have always gotten sucky ratings in repeats.
Law & Order is the king of the rerun shows. They can run those hundreds of times and people still seem to watch them.
Also, note that WB is part of the Time Warner group and they own cable networks too. TNT is one of them.
Fisrt I would like to state that I really like Chuck and will miss it when there are no more new episodes!!! (it will be a sad day)
ReplyDeleteHaving said that I don't think it would do well in syndication. The first time you watch an episode the show smacks you upside the head. The second time you see details that you missed the first time. And unless there are great eye candy scenes I really don't watch that episode anymore.
It's kinda like getting a comic book. You can't wait for it to come out then, after reading it twice you put it away and never look at it again.
TS
Also, as much as I love to see Sarah in any outfit, I'm just as happy to see thing heat up between Morgan and Alex, or even Devin and Ellie.
ReplyDeleteI do draw the line with the Buymorons. Altho Greta could work too.
TS
I have watched pretty much every episode dozens of times, if not more. So, could not disagree more with you or your analogy (which is terrible, since comic book readers read those things 200 times).
ReplyDeleteI guess we read comic book differently then.
ReplyDeleteCan we agree you can't have too much steam or eye candy on Chuck?
TS
Apart from the disingenuos scenes in the show (season 3.0), I can watch chuck a million times! The chemistry between the big 4 (josh, adam, yvonne and zach) is awesome and it drives the show to addiction level when they are on top of their game. Critics always say that there are better plotted shows, better budgets, better effects, better pacing but nothing beats this shows heart and the characters that fill the air time. So whoever says that you watch the episode once and that is it, is lieing!
ReplyDeleteAlso disagree. I like watching certain episodes over and over again, or particular scenes that were really gut-wrenching sad/tough.
ReplyDeletebut how has chuck done so far in re-runs compared to how a re-run should go? My impression is that it did pretty poorly.
ReplyDeleteA lot of cable networks have paid a lot for the license fees to show reruns and have been burned. The most famous example is when TNT bought ER. ER was the top-rated show at the time. It bombed as a rerun and TNT lost a lot of money.
ReplyDeleteSciFi bought the rights to X-Files repeats and it did much worse than they expected.
On the other hand, when Scifi initially bought the rights to Stargate SG-1 repeats, the ratings were fantastic. But, the show had previously been on Showtime and in broadcast syndication.
But, I guess it doesn't matter what ratings Chuck will get when it's repeated on a cable network, but what the cable network thinks it's going to get.
Barter syndication is another animal because the ratings will matter there. Income is based on ad revenue.
dkd
ReplyDeleteThanks for your response !
I'm aware that WB and not NBC gets any/all revenue that Chuck would earn from syndication . I was just wondering that in order for it to get a possible 5th season , that NBC/Comcast would still have to pay a licensing fee to the WB . That the WB would sell it to NBC/Comcast for far less than what it currently costs ( I have no actual idea , but say if this year NBC paid $1mil for each episode . Then next year for a 5th S and not cancellation that WB lowers it to say an unlikely $250k per ep allowing NBC to make more money on the show via advertising sales . Then in return for the lower licensing fee that Comcast/NBC would buy a syndicated package at a price that the WB would be able to make back some of the money it would have lost from the licensing fee . Now that Comcast controls all of NBCU cable channels (Syfy , USA) not to mention the ones they owed before would seem like a possible destination for the show to end up ) .
Sorry if this not make much sense :)
Anonymous™
DR, anything can you tease of 4.16 :)
"Apart from the disingenuos scenes in the show (season 3.0), I can watch chuck a million times! The chemistry between the big 4 (josh, adam, yvonne and zach) is awesome and it drives the show to addiction level when they are on top of their game."
ReplyDeletecouldn't have said it better myself.
CHUCK might not do great in syndication but I bet it does better than ENTOURAGE. :)
ReplyDeleteChucktv sucks!! that is all
ReplyDeleteChuck's decision to wait to tell Ellie he's a spy again puts him at odds with Sarah, who tries to convince him to tell her now.
ReplyDeleteJ asks the ALL KNOWING ...
ReplyDeleteAre we, as an audience lead to believe that Sarah actually dyed her hair for her mission or just that she's wearing a wig ?
By the way , COMMUNITY was pretty funny ..
8=>.
LOL
J, Sarah dyed her hair.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
ReplyDeleteI think what you might be saying is could WB sell the 5th season at a lower fee in return for NBCU also buying the rerun rights for one of their cable networks.
I don't know. Anything can happen.
If WB really wanted to produce a 5th season, they could sell it to other networks for a super-low price. It doesn't have to be NBC.
But, only the WB accountants know if that makes any sense financially for them.
Personally, I'm fine if the show ends at 424. We've gotten so much story out of this show.
dyed hair? I mean it's not like it's a different haircut or something and in 4.14 she's gonna have her old hairstyle... oh wait.
ReplyDeleteYeah, as it stands, I wouldn't be completely upset this time if the series came to an end after the last episode of the season. I'd definitely watch a Season 5, though, if it meant even more backstory, especially for Sarah. Granted, my hopes are still up for more of her backstory during the back half of this season.
ReplyDeleteI'm thinking we'll get some with Carina, especially after Carina discovers that Sarah and Chuck have been 'banging boots', so to speak. Man.. I can't wait for that scene, Haha.
DKD if you do not mind that the show ends at 4.24 then you are not a fan! Just Kidding you, I actually think that a great end point as Magnus said is a 5th season of 22 episodes. Where the show stops at 100 episodes exactly and they tell the fans stop buying subway, stop emailing the sponsors and thanking them and buying all their products.....basically stop trying to save the show. These actors have 1 season max more in them....then they have to take the path to movie stardom that beckons.....Zach Levi is already at the oscars this year....soon he will be a regular fixture along with his A-List buddies, Brad and George and Al and Robbie D .......If you love something then set them free, set them free!
ReplyDeleteHi DR,
ReplyDeleteThanks as always for your teasers. This one is a good one. Of course, most people automatically think about the proposal. Somehow I don't think it is that simple. Of course that could be what you're counting on.
But let's just say that they do get engaged at the end of 4.13 there are a couple of other things I thought this could mean.
1) Chuck decides to wait on announcing their engagement to friends and/or the General. There could be issues from the last few eps needing to be solved.
2) Chuck decides to wait on setting a date.
or the one I'm placing bets on. 3) Chuck decides to do things old fashioned way and decides to wait to have sex again till they get married.
Okay maybe not. I'm enjoying the different scenerios that I can imagining but I am content to wait to see what happens.
Remember there were some time jumps happening here. There was at least a month time jump between 4.11 and 4.12. From the synopsis, it sound like there is another time jump between 4.13 and 4.14. Enough time for Casey to recover and Sarah's hair to to back to being blonde.
ReplyDeletePaul, they have abandoned real-time or realistic-time this season. Essentially, when they need more time to have passed, it does.
ReplyDeleteRykeile, Sarah's backstory has already started (with her mention of her parents in 4.11) but it will continue on after 4.13.
"Paul, they have abandoned real-time or realistic-time this season. Essentially, when they need more time to have passed, it does."
ReplyDeleteTangential...
It always amuses me how it's always snowing/winter in Moscow, no matter what time of year they visit. Even September. So, the time of year seems to vary by geography as well.
But, it's good for a Casey "frostbite" line.
is the big surprise in 4.13 a character returns?
ReplyDeletedkd, why does it never rain on BURN NOTICE? Ever been to Miami? It rains ALL THE TIME.
ReplyDeleteI don't where my question went since it was the first one but here I go again do you know how long sarah is going to be trying to save mama b? Is it going to be until the next episode near the end of the season? can you give a clue?
ReplyDeleteGreg, you will know the answer to your question in 3-days.
ReplyDelete@Kirby, and everybody else here:
ReplyDeleteIf C+S get engaged in 4.13 then the most obvious reason for Chuck wanting to wait with the wedding would be that he wants that Sarah's family can be present too.
The classic opposite (re)action of Chuck after Sarah offered herself more or less to free Chuck's ma (and she also found Chuck's pa before). Sarah objects of course. The not-so-dark-conflict of 4.14 is born.
And it fits with the back story of Sarah that is restarted with the restaurant scene in 4.11 and will continue (DR/Morgan told us that)
BTW: I expect that C+S will be engaged at the end of 4.13 for mainly a lot of story-technical reasons (I will not go into that) but that the "big" surprise will be that Sarah asks Chuck. This ultimate gender reversal is too good to skip I expect.
Cool. Thanks, Magnus. Yeah, hearing the story about her parents was pretty cool, though at first I thought maybe it was another cover story. Then I realized how stupid I was, Haha.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I hope we see Sarah backstory that has Chuck in the picture, learning as well, and not sure her, by herself (or with Carina) learning about her through flashbacks. Granted flashbacks are fine if she's telling a story to Chuck or something.
BTW: My apologies to magnificant DR/Magnus to call him with the name of the bearded one.
ReplyDeletehere is a shot at the teaser, sarah wants chuck to forgive mama B, chuck is slow to do so, and another 4x14 ? - do Mary and Roan know each other?
ReplyDeleteHello Magnus,
ReplyDeleteI really enjoyed 412. It was a very good episode with another stellar performance by Yvonne.
I am coming back with the same question but now that we are closer to 413, maybe you will be willing to reveal a bit more about this.
Will they ever explain why, if Mama B is on the good side (which seems definitely confirmed), she put her son's life in danger by neutralizing the intersect? Does it mean that there is more in the new intersect that Chuck downloaded?
Thank you for another great podcast!
Just had a thought, given the way Magnus likes to sometimes be so obvious with the teasers, but throws us off track by being literal to an extreme, knowing that we will likely inerpret it based on our preconceived notions.
ReplyDeleteWhat if this teaser, "about everyone's favorite little romance", isn't about Chack and Sarah at all. After all, their romance certainly isn't "little" in most of the fans eyes, whether shippers of any stripe or not. Putting under their picture completes the diversion. Perhaps Chuck and Sarah are discussing some decision regarding Morgan and Alex, or even Big Mike and Bolognia(although I doubt that), and it's therefore not the least bit angst.
I realize I'm probably completely off, and I can't think of what decision Chuck and Sarah would be discussing about waiting regarding Morgan and Alex, but Magnus told us to think outside the box, and this is my feeble attempt.
I'm revising my spec just a bit. I think it will be the piece that Sarah gave to Casey to give to Chuck, not Beckman, that causes the flash of intel from the laptop. In that flash he will learn of the data center under Orion's cabin and its key to taking down Hydra and Volkoff.
ReplyDelete